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04-14-09, 04:40 PM   #241
Tuhljin
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Careful, Republic. That post looked a lot like the spell to summon the emoticon-wielding moderators - and I'm talking about the mean emoticons. Not that I don't get where you're coming from.
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04-14-09, 04:42 PM   #242
Vyper
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Originally Posted by Stormlor View Post
Please do not insult. I came here with an opinion. If your wondering of my qualifications.

- B.S. Computer Networking
- B.S. Network Security
- MCSE, A+, NET+
- Currently working in a Masters in Computer Science and Business. I have been working in this industry for over 15 years.

From what you describe its asking me questions. Do you have a DMZ behind your Firewall? Are you using NAT to get outbound connections coming in? Is everything Windows based or is anything UNIX / Linux based? Is WOWM hacking your DNS tables and making (A) records and making PTR records to their site in some way?

I understand they are a "parasite" but with networks nothing should be. This is a big site with resources (money type this time), you should be able to hire the right network admin that knows how to deal with these things. From the response that was given on this site basically all you did was a workaround.
I have my doubts about your qualifications because:
A) You have presented mostly faulty information (the standard port for https btw is 443 not 81
B) You seem to lack a basic grasp of the problem at hand. WoWMatrix is not directing traffic from WoWI.com to WM.com (abbriviated). Instead, they are using their client to scrape WoWI (very inefficiently) causing excessive load on WoWIs servers while hosting nothing themselves. DNS tables, NAT, etc do not even come into play. Everything is being done via standard http.
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04-14-09, 04:43 PM   #243
JediExcel
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Originally Posted by Tekkub View Post
2.0 was a very different beast. It was the only patch that forcefully disabled addons based on TOC number. Everyone had to update everything. Every other patch all that's been needed is the old "load outdated addons" and updating only the addons that have broken.
I was not aware of that. As I said, I don't have much knowledge of the tech end. Thanks for enlightening me on this
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04-14-09, 04:48 PM   #244
jadakren
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Originally Posted by downset View Post
man some of you people are pretty sad.
the service you were using wasn't a birthright.

Originally Posted by downset View Post
Put some of those dollars to work on a few programmers instead of trying to gather more page-views for add revenue.
Obviously your nick is indicative of your condition, because you failed to understand the running costs of actually providing a hosting and revision server to actually allow these addons to exist in the sate they do to begin with.

Manual updates, because I'm too paranoid to let anything automatic happen.
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04-14-09, 04:51 PM   #245
Kagaro
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Originally Posted by Stormlor View Post
Please do not insult. I came here with an opinion. If your wondering of my qualifications.

- B.S. Computer Networking
- B.S. Network Security
- MCSE, A+, NET+
- Currently working in a Masters in Computer Science and Business. I have been working in this industry for over 15 years.

From what you describe its asking me questions. Do you have a DMZ behind your Firewall? Are you using NAT to get outbound connections coming in? Is everything Windows based or is anything UNIX / Linux based? Is WOWM hacking your DNS tables and making (A) records and making PTR records to their site in some way?

I understand they are a "parasite" but with networks nothing should be. This is a big site with resources (money type this time), you should be able to hire the right network admin that knows how to deal with these things. From the response that was given on this site basically all you did was a workaround.

I really wish people who analyze/research what something does before spouting off information as if they were an authority. WM client uses IE on windows and WebKit on the mac to send the requests to both curse and wow interface. it spoofs a lot of the headers, including trying to spoof referrer headers.
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04-14-09, 04:54 PM   #246
Normal
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edit: I IS SLOWER THAN TEK
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04-14-09, 04:55 PM   #247
Slakah
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WowMatrix just worked
And now it doesn't. It really makes me laugh (althoguh sadly not suprised) that people are annoyed WoWInterface and Curse, when really this is WoWMatrix's own doing.
and trying to gather extra revenue
Or trying to stay afloat?


while doing a lousy job and breaking wow-player's only working option.
There was a time before WoWMatrix you know?

WoWMatrix was NOT sustainable, even if WoWInterface/Curse hadn't blocked it all that would of happened is WoWI and Curse would have gone under and we would have lost a fantastic reasource, and WoWMatrix would have been left in the same position it's currently in. Either way it's lose lose.


I'm pretty sure we've reached the point at which arguments start getting recycled looooong ago, so I'm just going to sit back and watch the "Why is WM dead" and "WoWInterface, Curse and Blizzard are Satan" threads.

Last edited by Slakah : 04-14-09 at 04:59 PM.
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04-14-09, 04:57 PM   #248
Tekkub
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Originally Posted by Normal View Post
edit: I IS SLOWER THAN TEK
DAMN RIGHT
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04-14-09, 05:08 PM   #249
Neuro
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Interesting side-note: the WM site appears to be down now.
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04-14-09, 05:15 PM   #250
Shirik
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Originally Posted by Stormlor View Post
Actually its not. Port 80 is used for people coming across. Like normal users. WOWM actually used a different port to get into WOWI. WOWM amateur programming didn't have sufficient ways (can't think of terms here) to be done via port 80 or 81 (HTTPS). I'm not WOWI's Network Admin so I have no idea how their Network Infrastructure is hosted, (not the site, the internal network). I have no idea if WOWI has a DMZ in conjunction with their firewall to keep port 80 hackers away (if WOWM used port 80)

I understand they host their own content. I am not saying anything about that. A lot of the content that WOWM was not through port 80, as a lot of it was saved on the internal side as well. Basically WOWM did hack into WOWI. How so we have no idea, maybe by a worm, maybe by constant hacking and seeing the port was open. I have no clue how the infrastructure was laid out, but if WOWM got through that basically means anybody with the knowledge and determination can get in. This is a security problem on WOWI, and while blocking ports was the first area of security there is much more that looks that needs to be done from the web front.
You are so full of wrong I don't know where to begin. So I'll just say this instead.

I have PERSONALLY reviewed wireshark logs of WoWMatrix for... about a few months now. I know EXACTLY what it does to get its content. There isn't a single piece of your post which is true. WoWMatrix used HTTP for its content retrieval and scrapes content as others have already pointed out.

Your qualifications are obviously bogus as you have no idea what you're talking about and, at the very minimum, have not done the research required to claim that you know what WoWMatrix does.

That being said, because you are obviously spouting off misinformation and, to put it directly, blatant lies, I have no choice but to make this your final warning: cease trying to defend your incorrect statement about how WoWMatrix operates or I will be forced to make you stop personally.
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04-14-09, 05:19 PM   #251
Kagaro
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Shirik, i didnt wana slam him that hard so i didnt.. Ive got wireshark dumps as well.


And for those who says they will just hack around it quickly .. I think not I helped pen test it on curse.
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04-14-09, 05:26 PM   #252
Spyan
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Originally Posted by Slakah View Post
And now it doesn't. It really makes me laugh (althoguh sadly not suprised) that people are annoyed WoWInterface and Curse, when really this is WoWMatrix's own doing.
Or trying to stay afloat?


There was a time before WoWMatrix you know?
Yeah, it it sucked. Amazing that WowI and Curse have been around longer and still haven't accomplished what WowM did.

Traditionally, this is when the underdog technology (WowI, Curse) comes out with a new version that is as good or better than the newcomer (WowM). Microsoft and Apple have been playing this game for years. Unfortunately it seems like WowI and Curse are more interested in preventing WowM from working rather than making their stuff better. What will they do next, a rootkit like Sony?

So, what will probably happen is WowM will find a way around the problem, then WowI/Curse will have to block that, then WowM will find a way around it...etc.

As for deep linking, it is legal. Just ask Ticketmaster. They found out the hard way.
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04-14-09, 05:35 PM   #253
LittleWhiteDove
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I am an end user. I do not know or understand current computer programing. I do, however, understand that sites like WoWI and Curse need income to stay in business. They provide a place of mod authors to put their game addons and they provide a place for players like myself to come and get the addons. I read the post at the start of this forum and from what I gather the updater in question, by some means I don't understand and don't need to understand, circumvents the normal access to these sites and thus prevents them from recording the number of people who actually visit their site. Those numbers of visits I gather are what helps the site raise money so they can be here to provide the service for us - the WoW addon users. That, in itself, should be enough reason for anyone to understand why they would want to block that particular downloader.

If people want to be able to use a downloader like that then every single person who uses these sites should be willing to become a site supporter and pay the small yearly fee that would provide the funding needed for them to stay in business. Just checked and while I am writing this there are over 4,000 people (I am surprised the number is so low it is usually a lot higher) on the site and less then 800 of them are paying supporters.

You want the world and you want if free. Grow up. Nothing comes for free.

Congratulations to WoWI and Curse for doing what needed to be done so they can stay in business for those of us that appreciate the work they do and the service they provide.

Last edited by LittleWhiteDove : 04-14-09 at 06:18 PM.
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04-14-09, 05:41 PM   #254
Kallieen
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More like less than 800 people who have registered an account...and less than 50 who are paying supporters. The other 3k are unregistered guests. I'm kinda curious as to how many people have the paid memberships at this point.
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04-14-09, 05:46 PM   #255
Tekkub
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Originally Posted by Kallieen View Post
I'm kinda curious as to how many people have the paid memberships at this point.
I am as well. I'm not a supporter... I know, I suck, but to make myself feel better I provide content for free to WoWI ^^
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04-14-09, 05:51 PM   #256
LittleWhiteDove
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Originally Posted by Kallieen View Post
More like less than 800 people who have registered an account...and less than 50 who are paying supporters. The other 3k are unregistered guests.
Thank you for that information. I did not realize that there was a difference between a registered user and a paid site supporter.
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04-14-09, 05:52 PM   #257
rc23
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Wowmatrix is the Ebaum's World of Wow Add-ons.
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04-14-09, 05:53 PM   #258
Kallieen
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Yup. That's why we have the pretty gold names and people like Tekkub have the plain white ones.

..except of course he has teal, not white. /fail
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Last edited by Kallieen : 04-14-09 at 05:56 PM. Reason: >_>
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04-14-09, 05:56 PM   #259
Tekkub
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I have a TEAL name, thank you. You can take your yellow and shove it.
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04-14-09, 05:58 PM   #260
Shirik
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Originally Posted by Tekkub View Post
I have a TEAL name, thank you. You can take your yellow and shove it.
I have a BOLD name. What NOW.

(But seriously we're kinda off-topic here >.> )
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WoWInterface » Site Forums » News » WoWInterface and Curse working together to help protect authors and other site-users

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