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-   -   Excitement for Classic's Re-Release Went Down :/ (https://www.wowinterface.com/forums/showthread.php?t=57380)

Fedaygin 08-23-19 03:25 PM

Excitement for Classic's Re-Release Went Down :/
 
https://twitter.com/MassivelyOP/stat...76999124885504

So it begins.. Shame on ya Blizzard & your Activision Overlords :/

My comment can be found there. Sad Face :(

Fedaygin -

Xrystal 08-23-19 03:47 PM

What can Blizzard do about it though ? The best they can do is turn off the ability to use the addon until they are happy it follows the time line for the LFG addon.

They can't ban the whole LFG facility without admitting they messed up in the first place, but they could say it doesn't follow the Classic system. Although, was their ever a LFG addon created in those early years ? But then that news report points out it could cause other issues.

That said, some users clearly want it. In 4 days it has amassed 12.8K Downloads. Maybe the same people that downloaded it are the same ones that will leave after a few months and your worries will hopefully lessen.

Kanegasi 08-23-19 03:54 PM

I don't see the problem. It's an addon, just don't install it. If people want to use it, let them and ignore it.

Tim 08-23-19 04:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kanegasi (Post 333328)
I don't see the problem. It's an addon, just don't install it. If people want to use it, let them and ignore it.

The problem with the addon is it's a good example of something where it could lead to other metrics of measurement that people use to determine who to invite. (ie: gear score type of stuff)

ClassicLFG from what it claims to do is just scan the messages and adds them to the addon. As long as the addon stays in the current form it would be tolerated but, once it moves on like I mentioned then everyone will qq.

lairdofdeath 08-23-19 04:28 PM

it appears to be nothing more than a chat addon really it looks for chat msgs asking for people for groups and periodically adds its own msg looking for people to join you

Kanegasi 08-23-19 04:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tim (Post 333329)
The problem with the addon is it's a good example of something where it could lead to other metrics of measurement that people use to determine who to invite. (ie: gear score type of stuff)

I still don't see a problem with it. The community has always gravitated toward that kind of metric. Blizzard has never even tried to prevent that kind of evolution, only provided their own metrics, like item level. Even if a minority of the playerbase hates it, it's still going to exist and still going to be used.

Tim 08-23-19 07:29 PM

Blizzard is in the process of breaking these kinds of addons now, yay.

https://us.forums.blizzard.com/en/wo...crater-illidan

Kanegasi 08-23-19 08:15 PM

Well that's unfortunate. This sets a different kind of precedent for Blizzard's control over addons that they haven't done in retail. It's great that Blizzard is providing a classic experience, but forcing the playerbase to socially behave like it's vanilla leaves a bad taste.

This is a video game, not a LARPing event. Blizzard should minimize their control and simply provide the game experience, not try to force the community experience. I hope the author finds a way around the limitations for those that want to use it.

Kkthnx 08-24-19 12:01 AM

Better remove anything else that too social. :D What a joke.

StormFX 08-24-19 05:09 AM

That "slacker" comment is pretty stupid.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kanegasi (Post 333337)
This is a video game, not a LARPing event. Blizzard should minimize their control and simply provide the game experience, not try to force the community experience. I hope the author finds a way around the limitations for those that want to use it.

Agreed. It's like they're attempting to force some sort of "Classic" RP onto users. It's stupid.

Tim 08-24-19 12:12 PM

The point of classic is to bring back a different era of the game people want to experience and play. During those times we didn't have all these perks and we shouldn't have them again this time around for a more pure experience. Sure there was an addon called Call to Arms but, that addon wasn't released until the tail end of vanilla which means we all did fine for 2yrs without such addons.

Your guys arguments are void from the get go considering there's retail WoW so if you want to play WoW why are you going to play an older outdated version of the game? Hell, why are you even worried about classic when there's retail? ... Exactly!

Kanegasi 08-24-19 02:16 PM

The whole point of addons and the game's API is for the community to tailor the UI to their liking, including anything that communicates, as long as the ToS isn't violated. The addon API was available in vanilla and it's available in classic. Blizzard has no right to enforce vanilla addons, they are only responsible for the game experience itself. Trying to force the community to play like it's 2006 is ludicrous. If that's what you wanted out of classic, Blizzard breaking addons isn't going to help you. Go back to private servers if you want a pristine community.

Also, you can't tell me my arguments are void. We told you your vanilla server argument was void because Blizzard said no, but we were wrong. Now you're on the other side, and you will be wrong. I want to play classic the way I want to play it, don't tell me to play retail.

jeffy162 08-24-19 02:58 PM

Yeah, but Blizzard isn't going to LET you play classic the way you want to. They are going to force (perhaps too strong a word for this situation) you to play it the way that they want the classic version of the game to be played. Which is, probably, as close to the actual "classic" version of the game as they can get using the current game as a base to work off of (or close to current, anyway). :o

HonorGoG 08-25-19 12:04 AM

Very Interesting
 
I certainly hope they don't decide that the enhanced functionality we've added into Titan Panel Classic, that wasn't present in the Vanilla version of Titan Panel, is a violation of the "Classic Experience". To be perfectly honest, the older Titan Panel for Vanilla was a bloated beast so maybe I should add some timers that do nothing to slow it down a bit. :D

Tim 08-25-19 02:11 PM

Lol. You guys act like Blizzard just broke the whole game by making this alteration to classic restrictions.


Quote:

Originally Posted by Kanegasi (Post 333349)
The whole point of addons and the game's API is for the community to tailor the UI to their liking, including anything that communicates, as long as the ToS isn't violated. The addon API was available in vanilla and it's available in classic. Blizzard has no right to enforce vanilla addons, they are only responsible for the game experience itself. Trying to force the community to play like it's 2006 is ludicrous. If that's what you wanted out of classic, Blizzard breaking addons isn't going to help you. Go back to private servers if you want a pristine community.

Also, you can't tell me my arguments are void. We told you your vanilla server argument was void because Blizzard said no, but we were wrong. Now you're on the other side, and you will be wrong. I want to play classic the way I want to play it, don't tell me to play retail.

Yes the addons are here to allow people to make their ui suitable to their preferences. Yes, the api has been available from the get go. Yes, with all that addons can communicate through a channel. Yes, Blizzard can change the way addons do X task if enough of the community comes forward as we've done to have certain things changed. All of us that want a more pure experience already know we're not going to get the full experience and we're over it but, if we can have certain things changed to get closer to the experience then we will. In the end if you don't like it well too bad, get over it or go to retail.


Quote:

Originally Posted by jeffy162 (Post 333350)
Yeah, but Blizzard isn't going to LET you play classic the way you want to. They are going to force (perhaps too strong a word for this situation) you to play it the way that they want the classic version of the game to be played. Which is, probably, as close to the actual "classic" version of the game as they can get using the current game as a base to work off of (or close to current, anyway). :o

Blizzard didn't do this themselves, they listened to big name influences and the community that has been pestering them about legacy servers.


Quote:

Originally Posted by HonorGoG (Post 333355)
I certainly hope they don't decide that the enhanced functionality we've added into Titan Panel Classic, that wasn't present in the Vanilla version of Titan Panel, is a violation of the "Classic Experience". To be perfectly honest, the older Titan Panel for Vanilla was a bloated beast so maybe I should add some timers that do nothing to slow it down a bit. :D

Your attempts at joking and mockery have fallen flat. Your addon was only used in vanilla/tbc due to there wasn't really any competition for data display. Sure people use it today but ui enthusiasts these days steer way clear from it.

Seerah 08-25-19 02:34 PM



Watching this thread... Keep it civil.

Everyone can have their own opinions, but in the end the only opinion that really matters is Blizzard's. Just because an addon is possible, doesn't mean that Blizzard wants that addon in the game. This will not be the first time that they have decided a certain (type of) addon goes against their vision. And it will not be the first time that they have purposely disabled or broken such an addon.

There are many QoL features that have been added (or made possible to be added by addons) that will not be in Classic. This is not the only one.

/edited to add: Those on the anti-LFG addon side need to tone it down a bit, too. Just because Blizzard agrees with you doesn't make your opinions more important than others'.

Dridzt 08-25-19 03:51 PM

Not everything that can be made should be made.

But since addon authors are not some kind of monolithic group that can self-discipline and there will always be black hats, it falls to Blizzard to preserve gameplay.
  • Blizzard declared babelfish (and similar in-game x-faction communication addons use to be bannable in original vanilla)
  • They protected the movement functions in early vanilla as well because for those that do not remember there were addons that let you input a series of coordinates and they would walk/mount you across the world even taking ships and zeppelins automatically.
  • They took steps to break original Decursive in BC.
  • They took steps to break AVR in WotLK.
  • They took steps to protect us from several Lua "virus"-like addons (some will remember addons that traded or mailed your gold when you went in-range of a mailbox or a specific player)

In other words they are fully within their rights to forbid and take steps to break addons that break their intended game design or can be used for unattended play (bot-like).

With that said.
This particular addon that they are targeting is both
- breaking the intended design as evidenced by them removing the built-in server AI that makes LFD possible on more recent versions of the game.
- allowing AFK forming and joining groups (which is unattended play no matter how you slice it)

Addons existed in 2005 (for example CallToArms) that did chat parsing or even helping to format and post messages and collect those messages (be it typed out, hitting a macro or using an addon) in a nice (for the era) GUI list.
vQueue (a more recent offering) did the same with an even nicer interface.

Both of them took existing information, collated it and presented it, but stopped short of automating the whole process start to finish.
You still had to use the familiar player context menu (or buttons) to /whisper or /invite which - from a gameplay perspective - is the equivalent of shift-clicking a message in the default chatframe to get class and level information on a poster and right-clicking to whisper or invite them.

If ClassicLFG stopped there and didn't let you bot yourself into groups, we wouldn't be having this discussion.
We'd have another perfectly acceptable addon with an even more polished interface that helps organize the chaos of user chat, without taking the player out of the group forming process.

Hopefully Blizzard takes a measured approach and breaks just the automation part (for example makes group invite require a hardware event, like trading does) rather than taking a more heavy handed approach and breaking some or other part of the chat parsing or inter-addon communication chain which would probably cripple anything from chat addons, to rp addons, to bossmods, to spam filters etc.

Edit to add: I hope the people that are protesting this in the vein of "but muh freedom as an author" have no issue with someone exercising that same freedom to make an AntiLFG addon that trashes the original; better not go down that road ..

Roeshambo 08-25-19 04:26 PM

The addon is absolutely toxic to the concept of community in the game. However, my biggest concern is this.. The only way I can imagine they block this addon from working is shutting down addon channels. And blocking addons from entering anything into chat at all (as they could simply use a created chat channel). This would screw over quite a few big ticket addons. Not just the LFG one. In all seriousness, this LFG addon was 100% possible in classic. Its just that no one had thought of it yet.

Fedaygin 08-27-19 04:16 AM

Good if Lazy Scotty Beam Me Up Addon does only that.
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by lairdofdeath (Post 333331)
it appears to be nothing more than a chat addon really it looks for chat msgs asking for people for groups and periodically adds its own msg looking for people to join you

This would be great so hoping it's like this :) I mean for those lazies who use it.

Second subject: Shame that Minion client still not recognizing WoW Retail or Classic folder when added :/

Third Subject: Wonder if data processing gets slower when install Golden early Days Adventures client to own folder outside the World of Warcraft Folder. Mean that still inside the BNet's, but not inside WoW folder. When i start doing that then i get a popup that data is not shared & will take more space. At first time during prev. S.Test i installed it inside World of Warcraft folder & then there's classic & retail separated.

I can stand that couple more GB Size taken when install outside WoW folder :) It's couple less clicks that way when going to handle savedvariables etc. Ofc could create shortcut to desktop that leads straight there when installed inside WoW Folder :D Hmm.

Kindly: Fedaygin

lairdofdeath 08-27-19 06:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fedaygin (Post 333381)
This would be great so hoping it's like this :) I mean for those lazies who use it. Fedaygin

yeah I made that statement before I learned that it was capable letting someone check gear score so people could deny someone to group for it and that just sux gear score does in no way let you know if someone is capable of playing their part in dungeons raids


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