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[Sketch]

Originally Posted by tintingurl let me make myself clear i would not pay for anyones UI that does not mean that others cant if they want to its up to them. and for what obsidianblack said it will not be for everyone and will be thier choice. as for mazzle doing all the work for free and so on how they should be paid for it , well like everyone is saying it was thier choice to do it for free they knew it was going to be a free thing.

So they should be penalized for deciding to no longer offer their time and services for free?

Can anyone say 'feeling of entitlement'?

And yeah, anyone could make a UI that looks the same (given enough time) but when every new patch comes and breaks it (as was the case with a custom UI I developed) it gets grating when you have to spend a day or two of play time merely tweaking the UI alone. And when you only have X amount of time to play (Having a young son does not afford much playtime I'm afraid :P) having something like this, that looks excellent and works well....it's worth 5 bucks a month for the peace of mind in constant updates and definite ease of use.

Also, the UI's appeal goes far beyond how it looks. Do a little research, please.

[cdxrd]

All arguments aside, this is the first time I've ever heard an author wanting to charge for a UI, and to be honest, I can understand the time and investment put into designing and maintaining a UI. I wrote a roster script for Vanguard for guild websites that had tons of info and features and it was a pain to maintain and keep working..

However, when I designed it I knew it was something I was doing because a) I enjoyed doing that kind of stuff, b) i wanted other players to have an option and c) I knew it would be for free. Doing something like this should be a labor of love and IMO, when you want to start charging money for it, your turning it into a job. Mazzles may be a good UI (never used it), but I see no reason for charging.

Needless to say, sure I may pay $60 a month for online games, but I'd never go and add on another fee for a UI.. Its just not worth it in my opinion especially when there are so many other options available out there for free. Just thought I'd throw my 2 cents in..

[Arkive]

Originally Posted by cdxrd All arguments aside, this is the first time I've ever heard an author wanting to charge for a UI, and to be honest, I can understand the time and investment put into designing and maintaining a UI. I wrote a roster script for Vanguard for guild websites that had tons of info and features and it was a pain to maintain and keep working.. However, when I designed it I knew it was something I was doing because a) I enjoyed doing that kind of stuff, b) i wanted other players to have an option and c) I knew it would be for free. Doing something like this should be a labor of love and IMO, when you want to start charging money for it, your turning it into a job. Mazzles may be a good UI (never used it), but I see no reason for charging. Needless to say, sure I may pay $60 a month for online games, but I'd never go and add on another fee for a UI.. Its just not worth it in my opinion especially when there are so many other options available out there for free. Just thought I'd throw my 2 cents in..

Let's not let this turn into another "should it be free or shouldn't it be" post. If the options are that a) those who love the UI must pay a small pennance for it's continued support, or b) the UI fall off the face of the Earth...I think the majority of us willing to shell out would much prefer the former. Those not willing to pay aren't out anything because if everyone felt that way the UI would disappear anyway...simple as that.

Back on topic, I too would love to see some minimalistic party frames, especially some that support better notification of curse/magic debuffs. As pretty as the models are, I prefer just having the one for the target only (unless they can all be fit into one side of the party/raid caves), and use the other space for other things like threat/dmg meters, instead of forcing those off to the side/upper portions of the screen. Support for Omen as an option threat meter would be fantastic, even if it still is a little rough around the edges.

[joive]

Originally Posted by cdxrd Mazzles may be a good UI (never used it), but I see no reason for charging.

Joive Ben Kenofizz - "Master, who gave Jar Jar CompBinks a Lightsaber? She is not a Jedi."

Qui-Gon Mazz - "Anakin UIwalker made a membership site on the internet. May the Force be with us"

Joive Ben Kenofizz - "Should I go and kill him now? We don't know what this situation may become later. Even Han AddOnSolo is selling Chewbaccazz for gold for the membership."

Qui-Gon Mazz - "He thinks everybody wants a lightsaber. How fool!!! There are free alternatives all over the Galaxy..... like stones and wood sticks. Nobody will pay a membership for a real lightsaber when you can build something that looks like one with some sand and Wookie hair. No, we are not going to kill him now. Lets keep sending Sithzz Aprentizzes to the forum.

[Mazzlefizz]

* presents Joive with the Award for the "Most Bizzare WoWInterface Response Ever" *

[Cairenn]

Originally Posted by groosome I'm sorry. Have I arrived at a site that sells UI's? I thought this was a site where hundreds of people share their creations with others free of charge. I can understand an author wanting some sort of monetary gain from their work, hell there are lots of sites out there that sell addons / mods, but is this the place to discuss or debate Mazzle's plans? Have a little respect for the hundreds of others contributing to everyones enjoyment of the game for free. If Mazzle wants to sell rights to use his UI than more power to him, however if he is serious he would setup his own site and advertise. Using a site that is based on the good will of many many people who like to share their ideas and see others also enjoying something they created is disrespectful of all the other authors. I honestly have seen more trouble from this UI than any other. The constant warnings while the Ui was being made, the constant policing of the thread by Mods on a daily basis. And now I log on to see debates and discussions that the author wants to make some money. Thats all very well and good, but if this site is going to be a big advertising pool for authors wanting to make money than I will move on to the many others out there. Mazzle decided a long time ago to release the UI and I'm sure there are many thousands of people greatfull for him doing so. But to than start advertising he wants to sell it really makes his goodwill shown in the past void. You Mods should be ashamed as well. How about policing the authors like you do the general public. Or is WoW Interface becoming a Corporate site and selling UI's ???

No, we aren't a site that "sells" addons. If you read through, you will see where we have stated that we will not be supporting Mazzle's site if he decides to go ahead with this. However, we have always allowed discussion and debate on this site, with some exceptions and following the site rules (courtesy, respect, etc).

Mazzle posted a poll asking if people would be interested. People are discussing it. If/when he decides to go ahead with such a project, discussion thereof will move to his site. However, there is nothing wrong with allowing discussion of the idea here in the meantime. Just as there is nothing wrong with those that discuss the fact that RDX charges, or those authors that have donation buttons in the description field of their download or on their portal, or ...

You can bet your bottom dollar that we police the authors as much as we do "the general public". In actual fact, we hold authors to a higher standard, and Featured Authors to a standard above that. To believe that we do otherwise is an incorrect assumption.

As a final note, the "the constant policing of the thread by Mods on a daily basis" is also incorrect. Within a Featured Author's specific forum, policing of threads is the responsibility of the author themself. The only policing that site staff do is to uphold the site rules. There is more activity by site staff in this forum than in other FA forums because this one tends to see more abuse of site rules than the others, followed by the Ace forum. The policing you see in this forum, beyond making sure people adhere to the site rules, is done by Mazzle, not site staff.

[vizax]

I would think that after 3 pages of threads, Mazzle would now have a decent idea of what he will be getting into.

*hands Mazzle 2 coppers*

Mazzle, I think you have a great addon going here. Personally, I am an add-on whore. I normally swap addons every month or two. However, I must say, I've had MazzleUI for quite a bit longer. I've even gotten quite a few of my guildies to use it. I enjoy most of the features of MazzleUI (a few changes would be nice, but thats for another thread), so with all of this in mind I would not be opposed to paying a minimal fee for consistant updates/upgrades. Being an ex-VB programmer, I understand the time and effort it takes to produce something of this magnitude. With that background, I am willing to pay.

Yes, this is not the kind of thing that everyone will agree with. I can't wait until (if) you do this. Your forums will probably be full of flame threads! ("DOWN WITH THE ADDON SELLER!" /sigh, get a life people)


Its a given, that if someone doesn't want to pay for the addon, then they won't visit the site. I say give it a try! See how it goes!

[groosome]

Originally Posted by Cairenn No, we aren't a site that "sells" addons. If you read through, you will see where we have stated that we will not be supporting Mazzle's site if he decides to go ahead with this. However, we have always allowed discussion and debate on this site, with some exceptions and following the site rules (courtesy, respect, etc).

The discussion / debate of Mazzle gaining some monetary return for his work has been ongoing since the early days when he was making the UI. Only back than I think he called it "Donations". When is enough enough?

[Gemini_II]

Originally Posted by groosome The discussion / debate of Mazzle gaining some monetary return for his work has been ongoing since the early days when he was making the UI. Only back than I think he called it "Donations". When is enough enough?

So? Like Cairenn said it's Mazzle's forum and she can do what she wants with it as long as nothing is against site rules. Discussion of this is not against the site rules, no matter who agrees or disagrees. If it does happen, then it will go to Mazzle's site and it won't be an issue anymore.

And please spend a couple minutesreading before spamming a thread. This initial idea was discussed ad naseum just a couple weeks back in this very forum.

[Stormlor]

Here is the thing to consider.

1) Which authors will support Mazzle. The Ace community more then likely will not. Mazzle will have to make his own addons to really sell his addon pack.

2) How much server space will be needed and how much bandwidth to allocate. If Mazzle advertises the hell out of it, then he might need a huge server which would cost him a lot more.

3) Blizzard being on your butt. As soon as you start selling something Blizzard will be watching you like a hawk. The reason why Blizzard shuts down the gold selling websites is not just because of the spam in game but because you are not allowed to sell anything that is written in the EULA. All MMORPGs share this in common.

4) Selling would be considered a business and will need a license. That means taxes. Donations are different because they are considered a gift.

5) Future? If WoW decides to die, that means your UI will not be selling and you will have to file for Chapter 11. That will not look good on your credit score / record.

With that in mind, Mazzle if you charge $10 a month per user on your website how will it feel when you have to give that all up for taxes and maybe a lawsuit from Blizzard. They filed a lawsuit against peons4hire and they got shut down.

It is a good idea, but really needs to be re-thought espically if you will follow the law. If your not planning on following the law then you might be in big trouble with the IRS.

[Mazzlefizz]

Originally Posted by Stormlor 1) Which authors will support Mazzle. The Ace community more then likely will not. Mazzle will have to make his own addons to really sell his addon pack.

Like I've said a billion times, I'm not including any add-ons but my own.

Originally Posted by Stormlor 2) How much server space will be needed and how much bandwidth to allocate. If Mazzle advertises the hell out of it, then he might need a huge server which would cost him a lot more.

Thanks for the tip. Are you suggesting a higher price?

Originally Posted by Stormlor 3) Blizzard being on your butt. As soon as you start selling something Blizzard will be watching you like a hawk. The reason why Blizzard shuts down the gold selling websites is not just because of the spam in game but because you are not allowed to sell anything that is written in the EULA. All MMORPGs share this in common. 4) Selling would be considered a business and will need a license. That means taxes. Donations are different because they are considered a gift. 5) Future? If WoW decides to die, that means your UI will not be selling and you will have to file for Chapter 11. That will not look good on your credit score / record. With that in mind, Mazzle if you charge $10 a month per user on your website how will it feel when you have to give that all up for taxes and maybe a lawsuit from Blizzard. They filed a lawsuit against peons4hire and they got shut down. It is a good idea, but really needs to be re-thought espically if you will follow the law. If your not planning on following the law then you might be in big trouble with the IRS.

*boggle* Umm...ok.

[Arkive]

I'm not positive, but I'm almost willing to bet that Stormlor and Auralei are one and the same. Not willing to put real cash on the line, but almost. I have to say Storm, you're a pretty funny guy. That chapter 11 bit was the funniest thing I've read in a while, even though I think you actually believed every bit of what you were typing. I think deep down you believe that if you go on and on enough Mazzle just might change his mind

[Shadowed]

Originally Posted by Arkive I'm not positive, but I'm almost willing to bet that Stormlor and Auralei are one and the same. Not willing to put real cash on the line, but almost. I have to say Storm, you're a pretty funny guy. That chapter 11 bit was the funniest thing I've read in a while, even though I think you actually believed every bit of what you were typing. I think deep down you believe that if you go on and on enough Mazzle just might change his mind

The best part about humans is the fact that they try and find patterns that don't exist, an easy example are the people who think that the Virgin Mary appears in food, obviously anyone who disagrees with you is just another person.

Idiots.

[Mazzlefizz]

OK, looks like it's devolving and time to lock another thread...