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12-03-11, 01:27 AM   #1
Ion Engines, Engage!
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Love and Hate

Well, the time has come for me to make some decisions.

Macaroon is limping along, and trying to fix it as it is just seems a bit of a waste of coding time.

Over the past 6 months or so, I have slowly been working on a new framework (more just to experiment with ideas) and it is looking like perhaps now is the time to pull the trigger and move onto the next better iteration of this line of action bar addon (for those who do not know, Macaroon is an off-shoot of Trinity Bars which came from Trinity Buttons)

So what is next?

Well, I really don't know. That is why I am posting this, to get a list of what features people love, and what features they hate. Go ahead, blast away. If you used to use TrinityX addons, list those too.

What I get here will probably help me form either Macaroon 2.0 (3.0 really) or <mystery name> 1.0 (I am leaning towards the latter)

So lay it all out, the good, the bad and the ugly. Just be constructive
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12-03-11, 03:32 AM   #2
A Deviate Faerie Dragon
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 13
Guess I'll be the first, what would be huge, and not complex would be to have class set up Main action bar templates:
Warriors - Stances
Druid - Forms
Rogue - Stealth etc.

While doable now, your normal Tom, Dick, nor Harry wouldn't understand the way we have it set up now, to do it by linking a bar with buttons to an empty bar that is bound to a stance yada yada, don't have to explain it to you, its your addon!!!

Since macaroon is my favorite addon, its the only addon forum I have subscribed to send me emails, and even I get tired of seeing hundreds of the same thread of "how do I set up my forms on my druid", so I can imagine you poor guys when you have to answer it over and over.

So that I think would be huge and a win win for you guys, cuts down the tech support needed, lowers the general learning curb, plus you guys on your end set it up once, of course with the flexibility that is loved, and all are happy. Plus making those templates 6 paged just like the blizz bars.

2. Also with dual spec, have some sort of option, to copy the exact layout to the 2ndary spec.

Lets say a non-hybrid class a rogue, now when setting up my bars, it takes time, to strategically setup my complex macros for one spec, but with a rogue you may only have 3-4 abilities different between specs that need to be changed. So with this option, when you elect to have that bar work as a 2ndary spec, you just change those 3-4 buttons and be done, instead of re-inputting every single macro for every single button.

Think about it on a normal main bar that's 12x6 pages minimum, multiplied by however many alts you have.

Edit: You finish all 7 alts and the next day, OMG Maul all my buttons erased, lol, j/k as far as the stability of that, I don't know what you could do.
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12-03-11, 09:10 AM   #3
A Kobold Labourer
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 1
Like it was said above, Macaroon is also my favorite addon. The one mod I deem completely neccessary. It's been fun over the years figuring out how to do different things on my own (hardly ever read the forums). I get friends complaining how complicated Macaroon is when I explain it and try to sell me off on some lame alternative, but none come close.

Best feature by far is the fact that you can make unlimited buttons and/or bars. Most other bar mods out there restrict you in this area. The most popular alternative will only allow 12 buttons to a bar.

Another would be cooldown and buff timers. I absolutely love these, and they're lacking in other mods.

Hard to pick any other one thing. It's just Macaroon's complete customization that makes it so great. From bar/button size, to macros, to layout options. Macaroon truly takes bits and ideas from everywhere and puts them together into the ultimate action bar addon.

I admit, I don't use multiple specs or a druid, so I can't comment on the more awkward issues, but the one suggestion I have is an easier vehicle/possession bar setup. I've gotten mine working, but there seems to be plenty who can't figure it out, even after it was made easier. But, I also saw you say you were working on a fix for that in your new projects, so, no worries.

Wherever your ideas take you, don't leave us without some form of your work!
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12-03-11, 01:22 PM   #4
An Aku'mai Servant
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 30
Thank you for Macaroon!

Best feature is unlimited bars, buttons, and macro characters.

Various tabbed states are a bit difficult. I got my druid and rogue working, but I've had trouble with dual spec and vehicles.
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12-03-11, 01:34 PM   #5
Coding Archmage
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Posts: 50
um, sorry if someone already said this, but i scanned the posts already up, and i didn't see anything about this yet, soooo.....

well, this is probably obvious, but the way Macaroon's macros could be 4 times bigger than the blizzard ones was a BIG help, in my opinion at least.

also, the macro Vault was NICE, too, as were the flyouts (when they weren't causing memory issues, anyway!).

Last edited by anseloth : 12-03-11 at 01:36 PM. Reason: added two more things i liked
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12-03-11, 02:05 PM   #6
A Murloc Raider
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Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 7
In addition to an unlimited number of buttons and panels, two most favorite features for me are the individual settings for each button in the bar (button editor); and ability to set several different states as stance, vehicle, posses, etc on the same bar.

And, of course, russian servers support

Last edited by t_gun : 12-03-11 at 02:15 PM.
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12-03-11, 07:53 PM   #7
A Kobold Labourer
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 1
Registered just to post in this thread...

Anyhow, I've used Macaroon when it was called Trinity Bars back around the BC era, which was when I swapped to it because a previous add0on, Flexbar went the way of the dodo and every single other action bar replacement (Bartender, Dominos etc...) did not allow for custom placement down to individual buttons or their configuration sucked. I recall there was one popular bar add-on that used cascading pop-up menus that reached ~4-5 levels deep.

Things I love about Macaroon:
* Unlimited number of macros or very large length. This is the most important feature to me. I could function without it, but this is the defining reason why I use Macaroon and it makes my life 10x easier once I've got things configured as the vast majority of my macros use @mouseover and other smart/context sensitive targeting queues.
* State-Sensitive bars. I use a moderately complex set-up where the multiple action bars morphs depending on possession/vehicle/pets, which keeps the clutter down and lets me configure how things should work and when. Remapping states into another is also fantastic to minimise configuration such as binding all of the druid 'travel' forms into one bar.

Things I wish could be better:
* Flyout macros have the potential to be so much more. The current configuration is rather obtuse with its syntax and limits some potential such as creating a flyout containing macros or perhaps a hybrid of auto-selected plus macros. This could also allow for action-bars that can be 'reconfigured' mid-battle when you have limited action bar spots, such as with hunter pets as I keep most of the important functions on the bar, but I have to change the pet stance/growl auto-cast via the spell book.
* State testing macros. It takes me a very long time to (re)build configurations because I use a lot of context sensitive macros. My druid takes the longest because I use large macros instead of having a specific bar for each form to help keep track of what each button's purpose is (which then helps in remembering the actions as I have the bars hidden). Having to write one macro, then test it by going through all of the conditions to make sure I'll get the skill I want is a little time-consuming. Having an option when editing a macro to 'fake' conditions would be helpful.

Things that I dislike, but can live with:
* Not being able to type in values for some configuration options such as alpha and scale. Having to scroll through the values using arrow buttons isn't ideal, but it's workable.
* The inability to customise the macro/binding/count text on buttons is annoying. The default doesn't always work well with some icons due to low contrast or the lack of outlines.

Things that I really wish could change:
UI layout is getting a little old. The fixed size windows for macros in particular can really harm macro editing when the line wraps in inconvenient points. Resizable windows, or even a huge megalithic window that has all of the configuration options such as the current bar configuration window that also has the button edit and has a 'shutter' mode to see the rest of the screen would be great.
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12-04-11, 02:44 PM   #8
A Defias Bandit
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Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 2
I briefly attempted to duplicate Macaroon's functionality with SuperDuperMacro + Bartender 4. The results, while promising, were still light years from where they needed to be. I am extremely appreciative that Macaroon is back, and is looking to the future. But anyway...

Things to Keep
  • 1000+ character length macro's.
  • Unlimited number of bars/buttons.
  • Bars/buttons change on dual spec, stance/form, vehicle/possess.
  • Profiles. Setting separate profiles for each spec.
  • Ability to change individual buttons between: macro, action ID, pet ID, etc.
  • Ability to adjust the action ID number on individual buttons.
  • Ability to disable the display of keybindings, macro names, spell activation glow, etc.
  • Ability to scale, hide, and reveal-on-conditional bars/buttons.

That's about all I can think of that I would like to see carried into the new generation.
Once you go gnome, you never go home...
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12-05-11, 01:42 PM   #9
A Kobold Labourer
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 1

Hi Maul,

Been a fan since Trinity and looking forward to MMB (Mauls Mysterious Bars)!

A lot of what I like about Macaroon is already posted above.

I've a few "opportunities for improvement" for the future...

Bar "Vault" or copy
I'd really like to be able to copy a whole bar to another profile or character.
The main reason is that Pet/Possess/Vehicle bars are painful to set up the way I like and I want it exactly the same on nearly all my characters.

Pet/Possess/Vehicle bar - ease of setup
I find it tiresome to create (say) a Pet bar... having to edit each button individually to set the pet IDs in the layout I want. Then again for Possess, Vehicle etc.

Two different ideas....
1. Allow me to pick up the whole button (ie: Rather than pick up the Pet ability from a button, instead pick up Pet ID 1 and move it intact to a different button - even a button currently defined as Macro).

2. Button assignment wizard
I'm thinking something like creating a bar with say 12 empty buttons in my desired layout and then clicking the "Pet Bar Wizard" function. This would then enable the Pet state for that bar and then let me click on buttons to assign the Pet IDs one by one (first button clicked gets Pet ID 1, 2nd button clicked gets Pet ID 2 etc.). This would let me quickly set which Pet IDs I want where.

Custom icon selection
Even before the current custom icon issues, Macaroon seems to reference the icons relative to their position in the list rather than absolutely. So everytime a new icon was introduced by Blizzard, all my custom icons would change.
Is it possible to reference them by name or something?
Also finding the icon I want make my eyes water. Perhaps the icon selection screen could be full screen and zoomable? Perhaps we could search by ability or item name that uses the icon?

Layout replication function
I like to have all my profiles in the same layout. If I want to change the position, size or arrangement of a button or bar, I need to manually change it on every profile.
Not sure how feasible this is, but I'd like to be able to somehow apply a layout change to every profile (obviously without changing the buttons macro/action/functionality).

Flyout button - drag & drop
It would be cool to drag an ability or usable item and drop it on a flyout button to add it to the flyout. <cough>Autobar</cough>

Flyout button - automatic by item class
Set a flyout button to show all the items in your bag of a particular item class (eg: "Consumable - Food & Drink" or "Consumable - Bandage" etc.). <repeat cough above>

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12-05-11, 03:50 PM   #10
A Kobold Labourer
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 1
My wish

Maybe its not possible,
Can we get some changeable buttons like flyout button includes several macro buttons?
Flyout buttons can have only spells,items or pets but what I want to get is Macro buttons including targets and spells.
The button will shows Icon and name of selected macro or spell.


Last edited by helloearth : 12-05-11 at 03:54 PM.
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12-05-11, 06:30 PM   #11
Ion Engines, Engage!
Maul's Avatar
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Posts: 401
Just wanted to say I have been reading everything. Thank you very much for some very comprehensive replies

If you are interested in alpha testing new code when I have it ready, send me an email to [email protected]
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12-06-11, 10:19 AM   #12
A Defias Bandit
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I, too, have been using Macaroon for a really long time. I don't think I could play properly without it at this point.

- Macro buttons - the fact that I can edit any of my buttons quickly is invaluable.
- The fact that I can have as many bars as I want, with how many buttons as I want, where I want them.
- Being able to drop anything, including items, to a button.
- Flyout macros. They're awesome. Please keep them in, in the very least for just spells like we have currently.

- Inconsistencies when it comes to bar states. For example, as I'm leveling a druid and set up my cat form bars everything works well, but when I learn bear form, bear form gets my cat abilities and cat form becomes empty. There are also some quirks with possess/vehicle bars - it shouldn't need that much time to set up.
- I can't get it to look pretty. ButtonFacade/Masque has always been screwed up in Macaroon for some reason.
- The current problems with icons, but I guess you know about that. :P
- The UI could use some work. I could perhaps help you with this if you want, I've done interface design professionally before.

Something I'd like to see:
- Auto-saving profiles. I use profiles for dual specs, and I often forget to save any changes I do before I change spec. Having an option for each profile to automatically auto-save itself would be awesome.
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12-06-11, 04:18 PM   #13
Ion Engines, Engage!
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One massive reply...

As I reply here, I am just going down the list to try and make sure every thing is addressed. Some info might be repeated

The new addon will indeed setup itself up with initial bars (2 or 3) and will have stance states flagged as appropriate.

The new design will be very flexible with spec changes, allowing for mere button data swaps to whole layouts. You will be able to flag a bar if it is active in one spec or both.

I always had the idea to allow for the copying of macros between specs, basically a one click and the macro from spec one is copied to spec two. Or something similar. I actually started on the code for Macaroon but never finished it.

Data stability really had to do with some design knots I made in Macaroon that I thought I had eliminated when Trinity did the same. The new code, however, is looking very stable in this regard. Other than your WTF getting nuked somehow, I do not foresee any of those "OMG Maul, where are my macros" moments.

Unlimited bars and buttons will never go away.

Buff and aura tracking timers will still be a feature.

The next generation code will be even more flexible, but it will be layered. A first time user will be able to install the addon and be ready for combat within 5 minutes of setup. The power user will continue to make extremely complex setups if they so desire.

The next gen addon will still be a macro action bar primarily, but allow for action ID for those certain situations where you might need one or two.

The next gen addon will have much easier to deal with states for the novice, but allow for the complexity Macaroon currently allows. Like I said, a novice user will be up and running in under 5 minutes with an action bar addon equivalent to the others out there at a minimum.

The next gen addon will always allow for the max size macro Blizzard allows.

The macro vault was a nice idea, I agree, but it needs better implementation. This is primarily a GUI design issue.

Flyouts will not go away. But the code is getting a complete overhaul and will be removing a lot of extra stuff that will be added to a new "Extensions" supplemental addon. Flyouts, however, will be a part of the base code, though flyouts that use items may be a part of extensions unless I can figure out a memory-friendly way to scan items each time items are added to inventory and thus check to see if the item flyout needs to be updated.

The next gen addon will allow for granularity in settings, but the first layer will be per-bar. If a power then wants to, then can then override the bar settings per button.

I try my best to keep the localization updated, but I made a mess of it in Macaroon (I thought I was being clever). The next gen addon will be using Ace3 localization libraries (gasp!). Mainly because on they have a very nice feature that supports localization efforts that easily exports to the Ace3 localization lib. This will be the first time I am using an Ace library in my addons. But to be clear, I have never had an issue with Ace before, in fact I support the Ace library effort, I just like to code everything myself. But the Ace3 localization library along with Curse provides a solution that I really need to take advantage of.

Go Trinity! A note on vehicle/possess. This has always been a pain for Macaroon to deal with. I think I have found a solution that works and seems to work well, though. /crosses fingers.

Also, the primary reason I use Macaroon myself are my mouse-over healing macros that are much easier to deal with than the Blizzard macro interface (I think)

Registered just to post in this thread...

Complex setups will even allow for more depth with the new code (I predict) but allow for simple setups too. Right now Macaroon supports one set of states to show/hide buttons. The new code is going to support two sets of states, one layered on top of the other. Details to follow as the new code matures

State remapping will not go away.

I agree that flyouts have a lot of potential and the current syntax evolved really from just being an experiment. Then Blizzard introduced their own flyouts and I had to integrate the code. I plan for the core functionality to be in the base code of the new addon, but then perhaps through a supplemental addon allow for much more.

Interesting idea on proto-typing macros for testing them. That is something I have not thought of.

I agree that my penchant for unique GUI widgets is sometimes limiting. However, Macaroon does have /slash commands as will the new addon. If you want to set a specific scale, you simply type /mac scale <scale desired>

I started to get into the level of detail in customizing objects like text, but I just never got around to it. Also, I hoping the author of Masque is able to add such customization.

I am really aiming to get the GUI in the best shape possible. Programming GUI's is the most time intensive (and boring) part of addon making. Hence, the Ace3 libraries that help with that. But then those GUI's tend to be very mundane and bleh...

I think the current Macaroon GUI has the right idea, just perhaps the wrong "feel". But having a larger macro edit window is noted.

A not on pet ID buttons. As of right now, I am wanting to take those out of the core addon and put the pet bar and its buttons into a different supplemental addon. This would mean that the core buttons would only be able to switch between macro and action, while the pet ID's are contained in their own little world. At one point I though Blizzard was going to expand the Pet ID range and that is why Macaroon has its current setup. But I do not think Blizzard will ever go over 10 pet action ID's, so into its own addon it will go.

Been a fan since Trinity and looking forward to MMB (Mauls Mysterious Bars)!
Hehe, a name to consider!

As I said above, the way bars will be done will allow much more flexibility to have them more easily used between characters. More info on that will come later, or you can join the alpha testing group to learn about it now ^_^

Interesting idea on picking up and dropping the action ID's rather then just the spells. That is something to consider!

There is already a "radiate" option in Macaroon that allows you to set the first pet ID then "radiate" the id's out the rest of the bar. But as I said above, the pet bar will most likely be its own addon. It will still be flexible, but the pet buttons will always be pet buttons most likely set with their ID's (or perhaps drag-able!)

The new addon will indeed reference icons by icon file path. Blizzard has forced this to be the way to do it

I will see what I can do to classify icons and adding filters (such as show all shadow spell icons only). That is an interesting idea.

The new addon will make applying changes much easier and less cumbersome to manually adjust (hopefully)

Items and the flyout code have been having a feud. If I recall, Autobar struggled at times with this as well. I will be working very hard to get items back into flyout bars, primarily because I like to use the flyouts for my rogues poisons.

You can set a flyout to set by class if you know how to use the commands. It is not exactly intuitive, but adding defaults that one only has to click on and it adds the appropriate flyout code is certainly doable.

The code to do have flyouts with macros on each flyout button is somewhat already in Macaroon through anchor buttons (I honestly forget if the current version has them enabled or not) Macaroon does allow the creation of a button that has a child bar associated with it that shows/hides when you click or mouse over it, the only thing it does not do is set the anchor button to the flyout button you click. This task is a bit more complicated, but it may be doable.

I think I have finally established state code that works very well. It took some time trying to figure out where states got confused and then showed a state you were not expecting.

I have never had an issue with Button Facade or Masque, but I know others have. With the introduction of Masque, though, I have redesigned how buttons are registered to be skinned and I think it works very well in the new code.

- The UI could use some work. I could perhaps help you with this if you want, I've done interface design professionally before.
I will take help from anywhere I can get it

The new design will appear to auto-save, so hopefully this will not be an issue. The current issue you are seeing is just the very poor support Macaroon has in its profile system and how it works.

Again, if anyone wants to try out the new code as it is being developed, send an email to [email protected]

Last edited by Maul : 12-06-11 at 04:22 PM.
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12-07-11, 04:24 PM   #14
A Defias Bandit
Deilian's Avatar
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 2
Hi Maul,

Like many other people posting in this thread, I've been using Macaroon/Trinity for several years, and it's by far the most essential of all the addons I use. I'm very grateful for all the time you have spent on this project over the years.

In general, what I love so much about Macaroon is the incredibly deep customization options, and the way it can be tailored to suit almost any character or playstyle. It sounds like the next-gen addon you are planning will be at least as powerful, so I am excited to see how it develops.

To comment further on some things you've written:

The new design will be very flexible with spec changes, allowing for mere button data swaps to whole layouts. You will be able to flag a bar if it is active in one spec or both.
As I said above, the way bars will be done will allow much more flexibility to have them more easily used between characters. More info on that will come later, or you can join the alpha testing group to learn about it now ^_^
The one thing I would really like to see is a more powerful profile management system. I tend to use one main button layout for all of my characters/specs, with slight changes for different characters and situations. It would be awesome to have a system where I could have a tree of nested profiles that manage different levels of settings. For example my mage might use the profiles, main.mage.frost.pve, and main.mage.frost.pvp, but instead of storing these as completely separate disconnected profiles, they'd be part of a tree and inherit settings from the profiles above them. I'd store the placement/shape of the main bars and vehicle/possession buttons and bindings at the main level, but I'd store class buttons and bindings at the class or spec level.

I guess this might end up being really complicated with a steep learning curve. But it would really help to maintain a consistent UI across characters and specs, while tailoring specific parts of one's UI for specific situations. Anyway, I'm sure the next-gen addon will be great with or without this feature.

I'll also echo what some other people have said about the macro vault. It would be nice to see a drag-and-drop interface to make it easier to create and delete macros, and to copy them to our bars. And I'd definitely be interested in alpha/beta testing once the development reaches that point.

Thanks again for making such a fantastically useful addon!
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12-09-11, 08:18 PM   #15
A Defias Bandit
Tealc's Avatar
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 3
Hi Maul,

I have been a long time user of your bar addons way back since Trinity, I have posted a few times in your comments and you have helped with a few bug reports that I have submitted.

Just wanted to say first up, once again, that I love Macaroon, best bar addon EVER. I also truly appreciate your limited time that you devote to this and your other great addons.

I am very excited to hear your looking to rebuild again and can't wait to see all the awesome ideas added. So far the list of things to stay and ideas to be added looks good.

Here is my input thus far...

However I have never been a fan of the separate addons. Even moving some advanced features of the flyout buttons to the "Extras" addon was frustrating. I would prefer to see all the addons together in the one package, so I download it once and I have it all.

Even though I myself have never used things like the bag and micro menu button addons and it has been great to not have them as I don't require them. I think it would still be beneficial to have them in the one place for people that may require them.

I also understand the desire to keep things separate in order to keep things clean from a coding standpoint. However from a users standpoint I would suggest you find a way to keep it all together. One thing I have seen other addons do and I don't know if this would even work or be possible with what you have in mind, but is to use "modules".

So the whole addon is downloaded together and each separate section of code is present ready to bolt on to the core and the user can simply disable or enable modules they do and don't require.

Modules!! For the next bar addon. What do you think?

Thanks again Maul for all your hard work.
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12-19-11, 03:06 AM   #16
A Kobold Labourer
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 1
I like the ideas listed so far and my main issues seem to be adressed

I love to have my complex macros handle everything from healing to actions per stance.

Looking forward to the next generation addon.

Happy Holidays!
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12-27-11, 07:04 PM   #17
A Murloc Raider
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 8

Like everyone else here, I want to thank you for the great addon. I absolutely adore Macaroon!

1. Ability to export/import layouts (settings, macros, etc) and be able to select the level of detail to import and export -- similar to being able to select what is saved for a profile. I would like to see this feature so that when I'm trying to get friends to try out your addon or I have an issue with setting something up I can either export an example or import an example someone has sent to me. This could also be used to assist with any possible issues -- whether they be user or coding. For references to user specific items you could simply comment that line.

2. Some way of finding where to set the option/setting. Right now I know there's a way to set the priority on a key binding, but for the life of me, I can't find WHERE to do so. I love the fact that it is so configurable, but without having a searchable help with screenshots (I'm not saying this is the answer) it is hard to find where and how to set certain options.

3. When a new bar is added, it is sometimes difficult to find it because it has no buttons. Perhaps someway of highlighting "empty" bars?

4. I like the idea of the scale-able UI options windows. I use a font addon because I have an issue with my vision at times, because I use that a number of the values for the options show up as "...". I also agree that all options that have a number of values that use arrows to set the values should also have a way of typing the value in as well.

5. I agree with the poster that suggested having Modules verses the mini-addons if it is not going to cause you a lot of heartache.

6. Back to the documentation, and this is for the more experienced user helpers: it would be very helpful if we could create a <insert new name here> Wiki complete with screenshots, setup, and how-to examples. Trying to search the WoWInterface forum for solutions to issues you may have when configuring really sucks and I think it puts off some potential users.

Once again, THANK YOU, Maul and your devoted fans and users, for your continued efforts!
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12-29-11, 10:52 PM   #18
A Murloc Raider
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 8
Great news!

Maul, I'm so pleased there is going to be <Mystery Name> 1.0! As a longtime Macaroon user I couldn't be happier that there is going to be some continuance.

I hope my input is useful, much of it is what I would have considered fixes to Macaroon, but there is some new stuff as well I hope.

1) Paging modifiers has some problems. For instance, button highlights and countdowns take nearly a second to update after the bar appears or disappears.

2) Stance + modifier based bar shifts suffer from a problem. Firstly, I had to set it up completely with custom bar states as it was impossible to have bear, cat, bear+shift, cat+shift. Say shift-bear has a button which changes into cat form, I'd expect the change to occur and to be presented with the shift-cat bar until I released shift. This is not the case. Instead it's the non-shift cat bar.

3) Vehicle bar has a problem where it suddenly disappears. I suspect that it has something to do with a vehicle bar that supports modifier paging so maybe when typing in guild chat or something the modifier is pressed, something like that. I haven't reliably been able to prove this though.

I tried to get around this problem by creating a totally separate bar which only appears when in a vehicle. This works perfectly, but it's impossible to set keybinds for it as it will override the binds for the main bar.

4) Flyout buttons are awesome! Definitely I'm on board with the idea of ensuring that the inventory scanning is not too exhaustive. One idea (althoug not a solution to the problem exactly) is to be able to create manually (drop on some water and fortune cookies for example) a bar with say 10 buttons, which then functions as a flyout. In this case it's not the auto-magic of the flyout that's desired, but simply a space saving action bar for things that don't require quick access.

5) I've had a weird problem with the bag bar. Whenever I reload UI, even if it's set to hidden, it's always visible. If I go into bar-edit mode and out again, it behaves and vanishes.

6) Cross-character configuration is often a bit annoying. My technique is that I maintain a "universal" layout which has buttons shared between all configs (mostly flyouts for professions, mounts, water, etc). The main action bars are left blank to be populated on each character. Of course, if I update the universal layout, this isn't propagated until I either completely redo all a characters buttons onto this blank template, or I manually update the char with the change. What would be ideal is to create bars in a global profile and then each character can use some of those.


Paladin Main Bar 1
Warrior Main Bar 1
Professions and Mounts Flyout

So on the paladin I use the paladin bar and the professions one, the warrior and professinos bars on the warrior, etc.

More complicated, but I guess also possible would be to be able to configure it on one additional level. If I could configure "Main Bar 1" size, position, keybinds, whether macro text is displayed etc, then the buttons on it are unique to the character. Hope that made sense!

At the very least, I'd like to go to something similar to the button store and see all the bars that exist on all characters and grab some buttons or even whole bars.

7) Various niceties I think could increase user-base for macaroon hugely. E.g. automatic replication of current action + pet + vehicle + bags + menu. Starting with nothing is very daunting for a new user. If a new user could press a button and have macaroon generate (upto) 10 action bars. The buttons would appear as the autocreated macros the same as if they'd been dragged on. Also, if a user currently had a macro assigned to a button, it could be copied (value, not reference) into macaroon. Maybe even the keybinds could be assigned automatically based on the current binds.

Basically this would allow a new user to install macaroon (sorry, <mystery addon>) and be able to run an instance 2 minutes after installing it. I think a lot of people are scared of macaroon as they are simply never able to understand how it works.

Note: I think it's totally infeasible for this to be a live mapping to the real action bars. I was thinking about this being a one-shot, one-way import.

8) Mlaarrghghgh, I switched to my alternate spec (with profile loading tuned on) and I'd forgotten to save my changes. Please make profiles "live" so that changes are reflect in the currently "loaded" profile. Or just save on profile-change. Also in that case, it wouldn't be a bad idea to remember at least 1 previous revision (just in case)

9) Custom button highlights. Maybe this isn't quite macaroon's job, but I'm unsure who's job it is. It would certainly be a bolt-on feature. At the moment, if I get a proc that blizzard recognise as such then the button highlights, e.g. Grand Crusader proc for Avenger's Shield or Overpower availability. It would be nice to set up some custom ones though. E.g. Highlight heroic strike when I'm over 90 rage or highlight Shield of the Righteous when I have 3 holy power. I know this is a separate problem really, don't worry about it! I can live with power auras which is actually still quite limiting (I want to have compound conditionals).

10) All the "hints" in macaroon just say "click to edit" or something similar. Even having used macaroon for years I'm still unsure what some of the settings do, it'd be really nice to have actual hints when mouseing over settings.

11) Blizzards flyouts (well, the totem bar ones at any rate) look really nice and not jerky like the macaroon ones. That would be nice! The macaroon ones often get stuck open.

12) Mapping of all possible totem bars.

I was just scanning the thread and found that you've actually already talked about a lot of this.

All that remains is for you to send me some code as I'm dying to get started alpha testing. I have some limited experience with lua, mainly fixing the odd broken addon for my own personal use, but am an experienced software engineer so should be able to give you some decent bug reports at the least. Also, I think my requirements for Macaroon are right on the edge of it's capabilities if not beyond so I can assure you the new addon will get the same thrashing during testing!

I think you should actually just call it "Mystery Bars"!

Great work Maul!

Last edited by dpwr : 12-30-11 at 05:54 AM.
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12-30-11, 07:24 AM   #19
A Kobold Labourer
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 1
Originally Posted by Maul View Post
Well, the time has come for me to make some decisions.

Macaroon is limping along, and trying to fix it as it is just seems a bit of a waste of coding time.

Over the past 6 months or so, I have slowly been working on a new framework (more just to experiment with ideas) and it is looking like perhaps now is the time to pull the trigger and move onto the next better iteration of this line of action bar addon (for those who do not know, Macaroon is an off-shoot of Trinity Bars which came from Trinity Buttons)

So what is next?

Well, I really don't know. That is why I am posting this, to get a list of what features people love, and what features they hate. Go ahead, blast away. If you used to use TrinityX addons, list those too.

What I get here will probably help me form either Macaroon 2.0 (3.0 really) or <mystery name> 1.0 (I am leaning towards the latter)

So lay it all out, the good, the bad and the ugly. Just be constructive
I love most of the macaroon features.
What i don't like are the changing icons (after each update/patch) und the junk macros that are not in use anymore but are stored in the character category.

Some import/export interface for the macros would be cool. Maybe the format macro bank uses.
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01-01-12, 11:09 PM   #20
A Murloc Raider
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 4
I love Macaroon, it's the first extension I install on any character, so please don't think my suggestions are criticisms!

Changes I would like to see are :

1. The Pet Bar

I can't remember the numbers off the top of my head, but my 85 BM Hunter has something like 16 pet abilities, yet Blizzard provide only 10 Pet:ID buttons.

I use Macro's instead, so eg :

#show Growl
/cast [btn:1] Growl
/petautocasttoggle [btn:2] Growl

These buttons work as expected except there is no feedback on the button itself to tell me whether Growl is currently toggled on or off (whereas in the Blizzard spell book the icons have a swirling pattern around them), so I wonder if anything can be implemented to detect if the ability is toggled on or off and display this as a swirling pattern or highlight on the button itself.

2. Timers on buttons

Again using my hunter as an example, "Mend Pet" is an instant cast spell which places a healing buff with a duration of 10 seconds on my pet.

So Macaroon gives the button no timer unless I have my pet targetted.

Initially I though a nice idea would be a slight extension to your #aurawatch command, so that a macro could say :

#aurawatch [@pet] Mend Pet
/cast Mend Pet

But maybe for even greater flexibility, you could implement a command which simply starts a timer or highlight on a button no matter what the rest of the macro contains, eg :

#auratimer 10
#buttonhighlight green
/cast Mend Pet

Of course a slight change to this would fix my pet bar too =p

#buttonhighlighttoggle green/red
/cast [btn:1] Growl
/petautocasttoggle [btn:2] Growl

My final request .. keep the name Macaroon <3. WoW would not be WoW without Macaroon!
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