12-11-07, 06:45 AM | #21 |
Cross posting by people who didn't author the mod
I'm not looking to overly complicate a discussion that has been so very very well addressed by the above posters but an aspect of mod usage that I don't think anyone mentioned is when someone else, other than the mod author, posts a mod to a site, other than it's author's desired home.
I'm sure we have all seen the "I am not the author of this mod. I'm just posting it here for everyone.". That can be a pain for people who consume that mod and do not realize that the posting will probably never get updated again and so will drift out of date and possibly become problematic. The poor user who downloaded it is oblivious to the author's desire to keep it on one or more specific sites for support and update purposes. Personally I never ever dig myself into that hole and always go to the source. Auctioneer is one such example. Apart from my comments here I too can see no reasons for the semi-rant of "Work for me for nothing and do my bidding" of the OP.
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12-11-07, 10:09 AM | #22 | ||
I chose to use WoWI as my projects main site. I chose use Curse as a mirror (less so since I'm disappointed with most of their changes). Still takes me 20 minutes+ to update both sites.
Titan has been a pretty dead/dying project for awhile. As you mentioned in an early post about a group continuing it, that's exactly what happened with Titan. Some folks were keeping things working with it, but I don't even know if they are still around. FuBar on the other hand it pretty well maintained. Wild shot in the dark that all your problems started when CKK switched to using Rock. It didn't break anything, just changed it. I'm not trying to be argumentative, I'm just playing devil's advocate. You make some good points. It is frustrating sometimes. Like Wowgamer mentioned, sometimes it's not even th authors who are redistributing addons. But the simple truth is that noone gets paid for programming these addons, therefore we aren't owed anything. |
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12-11-07, 10:45 AM | #23 | ||
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12-11-07, 12:24 PM | #24 | ||||||
your real point seems to be "if you build it...and they come...then you gotta do even more" and i just don't think that's true. again, authors write addons as a hobby and those of us who are users have a responsibility to appreciate that fact instead of complaining with righteous indignation about how we aren't being spoon-fed updates and newer and better mods. edit: finished a sentence in my mind but not on my keyboard. Last edited by Rigorous : 12-11-07 at 12:27 PM. |
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12-11-07, 01:32 PM | #25 | ||||||
The bottom line is these are "major" mods. I very much appreciate the work put into developing them, and applaud the respective author's brilliance. I am not a programmer myself and can't really imagine how difficult it must be keeping up with Blizzard's rather careless practices of updating its own product(s). However, I do employ programmers from time to time and know a little about managing projects. I'm honestly trying to be constructive here, not destructive. I am not being self-righteous, nor unappreciative. I want to help address problems, or at least as I see them. Okay, maybe I just wanted to discuss the problems here as I have tremendous respect for this community and its contributors. Come on guys, most of you who read this site have to agree with some of my points. What are some solutions? Or is this really just "the way it is and must be"? I love mods. I love mod sites. I consider each of you my close, personal friend Don't hate the player, hate the game? Okay, just kidding. Don't take my words too seriously. I'm not really griping without trying to offer something constructive. In any event, please don't be offended that I'm rather awkward in making my points. Rather than attacking me or my style of communication, how can these problems be solved? I think we're all on the same side here. |
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12-11-07, 01:59 PM | #26 | |
Don't forget the other projects that CKK probably has eating away at his time. He's a major (if not primary) contributor in the building of the Rock library, has brought us Parrot, Pitbull, Cartographer, CowTip, and many others aside from FuBar. If you feel CKK needs a lesson in efficiency...be my guest to be the first to try to offer it up. Maybe in the meantime...try a few different things with FuBar...see if you can find a earlier revision that was functioning before an update caused a problem with your current setup. Good luck Or, you could always download SLTimex, SLStats, and SLCommunity and hide all the other FuBar plugins! *wink* hehe |
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12-11-07, 02:49 PM | #27 | |
There sure is a lot to say for just the fact that official releases are sometimes published a bit behind the development revisions, which is confusing and does require to dig around. Well again that is the way it is, welcome to contribution based communities.
However,
PS: all this reminds me of the way Debian works: either you run the stable branch, which is easy and supported but you often lack the latest software or upgraded versions, or you run the testing/unstable branch which can be tricky and may break occasionally, but you get the latest and the greatest software available. Depending on how much you really want to invest into understanding the whole thing you have to make a choice at some point.
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Kaomie "WE LOTS OF PEOPLE FROM STRONG SERVER GUILDS" - Trade Channel |
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12-11-07, 03:49 PM | #28 | |
To the OP, if you really want to see updates to FuBar, this site is not the place to request this as the author (Ckk) does not frequent this site. Instead you want to use the WoWAce site (to be more specific, the Jira site http://jira.wowace.com). However before you even think of posting on WoWAce or Jira read this site first: How To Ask Questions the Smart Way. Although the site I just linked to is more directed to toward those posting on various Linux/Windows open source newsgroups/web forums, the points raised are valid with dealing with WoWAce (or even WoWI). If you follow the advice given you will more likely get an answer to your questions/concerns and you may even contribute to the process of updating by offering feedback in a form that the developer will actually read as opposed to simply discarding it due to being just another poorly worded/thought out rant that gets received in their hundreds. I know what its like to keep AddOns updated across several sites and trust me, its a royal pain in the rear. Thus I am one of those authors who has moved to releasing to just one site. Remember, this is a hobby for us, not a job. Once it starts looking like a unpaid job, then that is our clue to find something else to occupy our time.
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Last edited by Zyonin : 12-11-07 at 03:56 PM. Reason: Typos FTW |
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12-11-07, 06:03 PM | #29 |
Funny coincidence if you check the thread someone just opened next door called "cartographer problems". The version here is r30225. To most of us it seems obvious that this is old (wowaced addons are running into the r56000+ recently) and we just go and check WowAce to get something newer, but for someone who just discovers addons it may not seem so straightforward, even with the various links on the page.
An idea: maybe WowInt could automatically mark uploads that have not been updated for a while (let's say a month or two) with a warning flag as "old" and explaining newer versions may be available (without moving them to outdated which is a totally different story). No?
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Kaomie "WE LOTS OF PEOPLE FROM STRONG SERVER GUILDS" - Trade Channel |
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12-11-07, 06:31 PM | #30 | |
I'd like to see fixes, not updates. If updates fix the issues, great. If they are updates for the sake of updates (simple toc updates), then no thanks. For the record, I have used Jira and currently have an open ticket for the specific technical issues I've already listed as examples in this thread. Others have posted similar open tickets. They are not being addressed, and haven't been in some time now. Thus, it seems like it's dying. Thus, it leads to frustration. Thus, I started this discussion. We've come full circle now. I'm still interested in finding out the Fubar revision numbers others have posted about in this thread that contain no bugs. Perhaps when that response comes through, I'll be a satisfied and once again happy camper with the state of Fubar. Who knows though? Actually, if you check the Fubar Jira site, you will see someone else has even proposed fix(es) for these issues that have also fallen upon "deaf ears". In any event, this is only important and relevant here as it contributes to my reasoning for posting. I'm not being critical for the sake of being critical. |
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12-11-07, 06:36 PM | #31 | |
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12-11-07, 06:36 PM | #32 | ||
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12-11-07, 06:38 PM | #33 | |
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12-11-07, 07:54 PM | #34 | |
@Republic: I'm running FuBar r54616 (released 3 weeks ago), LibRock-1.0 r55267 (3 weeks), and LibJostle-3.0 r55679 (2 weeks) amongst the other Rock libs and Ace libs. All are current as of yesterday. I also got the old JostleLib r54514 (4 weeks) on my system and I wonder if that makes a difference. I'll play with it tonight and post back. Hope that helps somewhat. |
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12-11-07, 08:24 PM | #35 |
Just because it is "old" doesn't necessarily mean that there is a newer one available anywhere else. Unless there is something seriously broken in a mod because of something that has changed in a patch, many authors don't bother to update. We move a mod to the outdated category after it has missed a number of major patches. I'm not sure that marking something as "old" will do anything to resolve the issue being discussed, other than send users into a frenzy of trying to find an updated version when there may be no such thing. Doesn't mean we aren't open to the idea, just not sure I really see how it will help. Feel free to continue the discussion though, certainly willing to listen.
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“Do what you feel in your heart to be right — for you’ll be criticized anyway.” ~ Eleanor Roosevelt ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Co-Founder & Admin: MMOUI FaceBook Profile, Page, Group Avatar Image by RaffaeleMarinetti |
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12-11-07, 10:02 PM | #36 | |
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12-12-07, 12:50 AM | #37 |
That's a given with any mod on any site. It may work with "load outdated", it may not. How does that improve anything?
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“Do what you feel in your heart to be right — for you’ll be criticized anyway.” ~ Eleanor Roosevelt ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Co-Founder & Admin: MMOUI FaceBook Profile, Page, Group Avatar Image by RaffaeleMarinetti |
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12-12-07, 03:54 AM | #38 | |
What's the downside to providing this type of tag line? I can't think of one. The upside is that it leads to better understanding and exchange of information. I think that makes it worth consideration. While this suggestion doesn't really "improve" the technical process of mod functionality, it does help improve mod understanding. |
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12-12-07, 04:01 AM | #39 |
My point is that the tag applies to every single mod on every single site, which negates the whole original point of this topic, that being finding current mods. I'm not saying it's a bad idea, I just don't see that it really helps that much. Your point about novice users isn't a bad one, don't mistake me. But as it pertains to what this topic was originally about, it really doesn't address the issue at all.
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“Do what you feel in your heart to be right — for you’ll be criticized anyway.” ~ Eleanor Roosevelt ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Co-Founder & Admin: MMOUI FaceBook Profile, Page, Group Avatar Image by RaffaeleMarinetti |
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12-12-07, 04:01 PM | #40 | ||
there seems to me to be an onus being placed on both WoWI and the authors to be responsible for nearly every aspect of every users' interface add-on "experience" once they begin to use add-ons and i think that's an unreasonable expectation. as Republic said:
at the end of the day, imo, it's up to the user take responsibility for themself, use the resources that are obviously available and learn. the authors and the websites shouldn't be held to the lowest common denominator as a baseline. |
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WoWInterface » AddOns, Compilations, Macros » AddOn Search/Requests » Panel Mod Disgust |
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