WoWInterface and Curse working together to help protect authors and other site-users

[HonorGoG]

Originally Posted by Lykofos I actually have seen an author revoke an user's license to use that author's AddOns after the user complained that he could not get it via WoWMatrix. The author does have the authority to do this. The term "We reserve the right to refuse service" applies to most of the AddOns released.

Uh oh. It's called frustration.

[Tekkub]

The right to refuse service is the best one there is. I wish I got to use it more with my job...

[HonorGoG]

Originally Posted by Tekkub Authors that know me know they're welcome to take my code and do anything they want with it, and they don't' have to credit me at all.

Very true. In fact, Tekkub is why I'm here today. If he hadn't allowed me to adopt DefenseTracker way back in the day, I wouldn't be on the Titan Development Team now or developing other addons. I still list him as the original creator too. So now you all know who to blame.

[us2006027321]

Originally Posted by Tekkub The right to refuse service is the best one there is. I wish I got to use it more with my job...

The interesting thing about that statement is that this whole argument really boils down to a series of statements:

End user: I want your mods on my terms, not yours!

Developer and developers' support: Too bad. Less qq, moar pewpew.

End user: QQ!

Developer and developers' support: Stfu and move on, nub. There's nothing to see here.

No matter who presents what perspective, how well the perspectives are organized and expressed, or what new angle is inspected or investigated, we will never see a statement beyond those expressions.

Really, the developers and their support hold all the cards, and there isn't anything that can be done about it. Accept what you can't change and control the variables you can. Each of us as individuals are the only variables we control. Trying to exert control over anything else is like... well... teaching a pig how to sing.

[HonorGoG]

What The FUUUUU?

I've been registered on this site for over a year now and I'm still A Deviate Faerie Dragon.

us2006027321 is here two weeks and he's A Cyclonian.

I am depressed.

[Cairenn]

You just need to post more, sweetie.

[Zyonin]

Originally Posted by HonorGoG What The FUUUUU? I've been registered on this site for over a year now and I'm still A Deviate Faerie Dragon. us2006027321 is here two weeks and he's A Cyclonian. I am depressed.

It's time to do some spamming...

[us2006027321]

Originally Posted by HonorGoG us2006027321 is here two weeks and he's A Cyclonian. I am depressed.

/flex

EDIT: This post made me a Wyrmkin Dreamwalker.

Originally Posted by Lykofos It's time to do some spamming...

I'll have you know that I earned my title with mostly equitable posts, thank you very much!! Harumph! ><


In other news, I've changed my siggie, and for the hour and a half of work it took (not including screenshot time), I think I'm going to keep it for a bit.

[Bluspacecow]

Originally Posted by HonorGoG What The FUUUUU? I've been registered on this site for over a year now and I'm still A Deviate Faerie Dragon. us2006027321 is here two weeks and he's A Cyclonian. I am depressed.

Ha !

I'm a delicate,unique snowflake.

Beat that !

[us2006027321]

Originally Posted by honem I'm a delicate,unique snowflake.

It would happen that you're also a hacker.

[Yhor]

Originally Posted by honem Ha ! I'm a delicate,unique snowflake. Beat that !

You obviously haven't seen my title... and noo, I didn't put it there..

[MMcCroskey]

Someone asked in answer to my previous post if I would be willing to use WoWI for my updating . . . SURE!!

I am so stupid about all this, that I have zero understanding of all this talk of "loyalty" to one site over another.

I am your standard consumer - please give me a good product that functions well and serves my needs, and I will pay you if the price is reasonable to the functions.

That said, I would like to point out that when I press the link to go to the WoWI updater, I am directed to a post with a HUGE warning that states the updater used here is out of date and might not work properly. This is hardly a reasonable substitute to WoWMatrix's ease of use.

I TOTALLY get it that WoWI and Curse should not put up with someone using their site to profit, but it just seems we are all caught in the midst of a negotiation of some sort . . . and I am just STRONGLY hoping they come to some reasonable solution.

I am already learning to use some of the WoW UI interfaces that are new, and maybe this is the future - but I for one do not think a single source (Blizz) is a good idea if we want innovation.

WHOEVER comes up with a good solution, for what my 2 cents is worth, I will be willing to pay if the amount does not seem out of line with the service.

I estimate I have donated over the past 2 years or so $40-50 dollars to mostly auctioneer (my vote for the best single addon in the game), outfitter, carbonite and a few others I cant recall exactly.

I recently used the new popup on WoWMatrix to donate $5 each to 2 of the authors that I just updated. This popup comes up each time you update on WoWMatrix now (I just wish they could help me track what I have given, will be hard to remember over time - hint to WoWI for their solution lol).

This can be done folks, and the first one that can provide ease of use gets my business. And yes, if someone comes out with a better system at the same or better price, I will be open to using their system. Its how capitalism drive innovation, and that is a good thing.

I DO respect EVERYONE's right to do business as they see fit - any other way of looking at it is just plain selfish and mule-headed.

[Slilialumen]

While I understand the annoyance at WOWMATRIX for sucking bandwidth, and I agree author information should have always been included and accessable, it does not change the facts.

BLIZZ addon developement rules require:

1) Add-ons must be free of charge.
a. All add-ons must be distributed free of charge.
b. Developers may not create "premium" versions of add-ons with additional for-pay features, charge money to download an add-on, charge for services related to the add-on, or otherwise require some form of monetary compensation to download or access an add-on.


So if someone comes up with a better client (i.e. WOWMATRIX) for people to use to update their addons, they have every right in the world to do it. If you block them you are violating 1) a. Free Distribution.

In addition the Curse Client, with its Pay for version clearly violates the underlined section of 1) b. no charges for additional services (updating).

Don't be shocked when Blizz invokes rule 8.

8) Blizzard Entertainment has the right to disable add-on functionality as it sees fit.
To maintain the integrity World of Warcraft and ensure the best possible gaming experience for our players, Blizzard Entertainment reserves the right to disable any add-on functionality within World of Warcraft at its sole discretion. For more information...

[Vyper]

Originally Posted by Slilialumen While I understand the annoyance at WOWMATRIX for sucking bandwidth, and I agree author information should have always been included and accessable, it does not change the facts. BLIZZ addon developement rules require: 1) Add-ons must be free of charge. a. All add-ons must be distributed free of charge. b. Developers may not create "premium" versions of add-ons with additional for-pay features, charge money to download an add-on, charge for services related to the add-on, or otherwise require some form of monetary compensation to download or access an add-on. So if someone comes up with a better client (i.e. WOWMATRIX) for people to use to update their addons, they have every right in the world to do it. If you block them you are violating 1) a. Free Distribution. In addition the Curse Client, with its Pay for version clearly violates the underlined section of 1) b. no charges for additional services (updating).

You are confusing distributed free of charge with free distribution. Two very different concepts. Distributed free of charge means I can't charge any money for my addon. I can still hold all the distribution rights, not allowing anyone other than me to distribute the addon.

Also you clearly lack a basic understanding of free distribution. Even if all addons were free distribution which they are not, that would only mean that WoWMatrix would have the right to distribute them themselves NOT make WoWInterface do it for them.
When distributing Free Software, the host can impose any limitations on that distribution they so choose (provided it does not interfere with the license), including what clients can be used to access that content e.g. no spiders (such as WoWMatrix). They cannot stop others from hosting (but WoWMatrix wasn't, and its all moot, because addons are not free distribution).

[Kaelten]

Originally Posted by honem Ha ! I'm a delicate,unique snowflake. Beat that !

I am jack's raging bile duct.

[Seerah]

Originally Posted by us2006027321 It would happen that you're also a hacker.

Nope - premium members get to create their own titles

[Tristanian]

Originally Posted by Slilialumen While I understand the annoyance at WOWMATRIX for sucking bandwidth, and I agree author information should have always been included and accessable, it does not change the facts. BLIZZ addon developement rules require: 1) Add-ons must be free of charge. a. All add-ons must be distributed free of charge. b. Developers may not create "premium" versions of add-ons with additional for-pay features, charge money to download an add-on, charge for services related to the add-on, or otherwise require some form of monetary compensation to download or access an add-on. So if someone comes up with a better client (i.e. WOWMATRIX) for people to use to update their addons, they have every right in the world to do it. If you block them you are violating 1) a. Free Distribution. In addition the Curse Client, with its Pay for version clearly violates the underlined section of 1) b. no charges for additional services (updating). Don't be shocked when Blizz invokes rule 8. 8) Blizzard Entertainment has the right to disable add-on functionality as it sees fit. To maintain the integrity World of Warcraft and ensure the best possible gaming experience for our players, Blizzard Entertainment reserves the right to disable any add-on functionality within World of Warcraft at its sole discretion. For more information...

Free distribution and distributed for free meaning without some form of monetary compensation is 2 different things.

The Curse client in its "regular user" incarnation allows you to download any addon you like without paying a dime. Hell, if you hate the client so much, you can even go to Curse and download the addon manually FOR FREE. Curse Premium simply adds one more feature to the client (among other things), most notably the "Update All" feature. It is well within their rights to charge for something in their own 3rd party application, considering that you do not even REQUIRE said application to get your addons...for FREE.

[Tuhljin]

Okay, you guys covered this already, but I like my answer so I'm posting it anyway.

Blizzard can't go after Curse for offering a more convenient and faster way to download addons to premium members any more than they can go after your ISP for offering faster connection speeds to those who pay more per month.

[Tekkub]

Originally Posted by MMcCroskey it just seems we are all caught in the midst of a negotiation of some sort

ne⋅go⋅ti⋅a⋅tion   [ni-goh-shee-ey-shuhn, -see-]
–noun
1. mutual discussion and arrangement of the terms of a transaction or agreement: the negotiation of a treaty.

There has never been any discussion, nothing mutual, nor any signs of an arrangement, agreement or transaction. WM is just hiding in a corner pretending they didn't do anything bad and not talking to anyone.

[us2006027321]

Originally Posted by MMcCroskey Someone asked in answer to my previous post if I would be willing to use WoWI for my updating . . . SURE!! That said, I would like to point out that when I press the link to go to the WoWI updater, I am directed to a post with a HUGE warning that states the updater used here is out of date and might not work properly. This is hardly a reasonable substitute to WoWMatrix's ease of use. I TOTALLY get it that WoWI and Curse should not put up with someone using their site to profit, but it just seems we are all caught in the midst of a negotiation of some sort . . . and I am just STRONGLY hoping they come to some reasonable solution.I DO respect EVERYONE's right to do business as they see fit - any other way of looking at it is just plain selfish and mule-headed.

I had asked if you would be willing to use WoWI, and I may not have been clear enough, but I though I had mentioned that they were coming out with a new one that wasn't out of date. I know the current one is... somewhat less than ideal, and I didn't mean to imply to you that you should go do that right this minute. >< I was asking if after they came out with their new one you would be willing to give it a try, and it sounds like you're a reasonable enough kind of guy to be willing to do that. I understand that right now, WM users are in a difficult place because reasonable solutions aren't available yet, and broken I.W.I.N. buttons make things tough. WoWI is working on it, and I have confidence that they are working on it well with earnest and precision.

Ultimately, I just love that you came here not being "selfish and mule-headed". Btw, are you single and interested? If not, do you have any equally inellectually attractive relatives or friends who would be single and interested?

I'm kidding. >< That was for Torhal and his Craig's List comment a couple pages back.

Originally Posted by Kaelten I am jack's raging bile duct.

Please, please, please, don't make yourself an easy target. I like taking pot-shots...

*spends two willpower dots not engaging his vices, and shakes his head...*